Delucidazioni su post wo fai da te!

[Ozn]

Avendo giuseppe che in ogni post mio deve mettere becco usando una certa presunzione, sto solo rispondendo!

Poi se uno mi dice che il vitargo lo deve usare chi fa sport aerobici e basta in effetti c'è poco da rispondere

Giuseppe esprime la sua opinione, tu la tua; Chi chiede informazioni é libero di decidere.
Chiudiamo questa parentesi e torniamo in topic. Grazie

[Iruka]

Giuseppe esprime la sua opinione, tu la tua; Chi chiede informazioni é libero di decidere.
Chiudiamo questa parentesi e torniamo in topic. Grazie

Ovvio, ma avere un utente che continua a postare faccine strane sotto i miei post senza giustificare nulla mi fa alterare.

Comunque tornando a noi si SECONDO ME il vitargo è il top post wo, costa di piu ma è migliore... Le maltodestrine sono meno tecniche (anch esse create x sport arobici) e il destrosio lo lascerei proprio stare visto il picco insulinico.
il vitargo da un picco piu basso ma viene assorbito prima grazie alla sua osmolarità, a patto che venga assunto a una 20 di minuti di distanza dalle pro!

[brosgym]

Allora diciamo le cose come stanno:
Il vitargo ha una osmolarità bassa (è u polimero) quindi non si corre il rischio (non certezza) di richiamare acqua nell'intestino, con conseguente malassorbimento e/o diarrea.
Il picco insulinico è poco più basso ma questo non è detto che sia un bene in ottica cortisol control (che è a cosa principale postwo di pesi) se il picco è più alto ne serve meno

[Iruka]

Allora diciamo le cose come stanno: Il vitargo ha una osmolarità bassa (è u polimero) quindi non si corre il rischio (non certezza) di richiamare acqua nell'intestino, con conseguente malassorbimento e/o diarrea. Il picco insulinico è poco più basso ma questo non è detto che sia un bene in ottica cortisol control (che è a cosa principale postwo di pesi) se il picco è più alto ne serve meno

si ma allo stesso tempo viene assorbito più velocemente rispetto a maltodestrine o destrosio, proprio grazie all'osmolarità.

comunque per qualsiasi confronto tecnico potete leggere qui: il Vitargo si distingue dagli altri integratori per l'elevato peso molecolare, indice della complessità della catena glucidica che lo costituisce. Un ulteriore parametro che quantifica tale caratteristica è la cosiddetta destrosio equivalenza (DE); tanto più questo valore è basso e tanto maggiore risulta la complessità della catena glucidica che costituisce il carboidrato. Il Vitargo, pertanto, si distingue dagli altri integratori energetici per un peso molecolare superiore e per una destrosio equivalenza inferiore. Tutte queste caratteristiche conferiscono al Vitargo interessanti proprietà nutrizionali. Tra queste, la più interessante e pubblicizzata riguarda l'assorbimento intestinale del carboidrato. Ricordiamo brevemente che l'osmosi rappresenta il passaggio del solvente - attraverso una membrana semipermeabile - dal compartimento in cui i soluti sono più diluiti a quello in cui sono più concentrati. Se prendiamo un comune Energy drink, il solvente è l'acqua ed i soluti i carboidrati in essa disciolti. L'osmolarità esprime la concentrazione di una soluzione, sottolineando il numero di particelle in essa disciolte (indipendentemente dalla carica elettrica e dalle dimensioni). L'osmolarità di una soluzione aumenta all'aumentare del numero di particelle che contiene; di conseguenza, una bevanda a base di glucosio ha un'osmolarità superiore rispetto alla sua controparte a base di Vitargo. Anche l'aggiunta di elettroliti (sali minerali), così come di conservanti e dolcificanti artificiali, aumenta l'osmolarità della soluzione. In condizioni normali l'osmolarità del plasma i si aggira tra i 280 ed i 330mOsm/kg. Valori simili si riscontrano nelle bevande cosiddette isotoniche, valori superiori in quelle ipertoniche ed inferiori in quelle ipotoniche. Una volta ingerite, le bevande ipertoniche (molto concentrate, quindi con osmolarità elevata), per le sopraccitate leggi dell'osmosi, richiamano liquidi nello stomaco (ritardandone lo svuotamento) e nel lume intestinale, aggravando la disidratazione e divenendo fonte di possibili disordini intestinali (diarrea). Il fenomeno inverso è invece tipico delle bevande ipotoniche, come quelle a base di vitargo, ideali per un rapido assorbimento al termine di uno sforzo. Vitargo L'ultimo parametro da considerare per capire le proprietà del Vitargo è l'indice glicemico. Com'è noto ai più questo valore rappresenta la velocità con cui aumenta la glicemia in carboidrati. Tanto più semplice è la loro struttura e tanto più alto risulta l'indice glicemico, e viceversa. Il Vitargo, pertanto, in teoria dovrebbe presentare un indice glicemico inferiore rispetto agli altri carboidrati contenuti negli integratori energetici. Il motivo di questa relazione risiede nei maggiori tempi di digestione necessari per scomporre le sue lunghe catene, il che garantirebbe un flusso costante di glucosio, prevenendo eccessivi picchi glicemici ed insulinici. Nonostante le premesse teoriche, sul proprio sito internet l'azienda comunica che, pur non esistendo dati specifici, i valori di glucosio ed insulina registrati dopo assunzione di vitargo, lasciano suppore un indice glicemico superiore rispetto alle maltodestrine, pari a circa 137 (valore evidentemente calcolato prendendo come riferimento a 100 l'indice glicemico del pane bianco, secondo il quale il glucosio mostra un indice glicemico pari a 140; di conseguenza il vitargo presenterebbe un indice glicemico sovrapponibile a quello del glucosio puro). Evidentemente la struttura del vitargo è più ramificata rispetto a quella delle maltodestrine, il che facilita l'azione delle amilasi esponendo alla loro azione una maggiore superficie specifica del carboidrato. Tutte queste caratteristiche giustificano la grande efficacia del Vitargo nel ripristino delle riserve muscolari ed epatiche di glicogeno dopo un intenso sforzo fisico. Nel corso di diversi studi tale proprietà si è dimostrata di gran lunga superiore rispetto a quella di altri comuni integratori di carboidrati. I primi a beneficiare di questa interessante proprietà sono, per ovvie ragioni, gli atleti di endurance (ciclisti, maratoneti, sciatori di fondo, triatleti ecc.). Anche i culturisti possono sfruttare le proprietà del Vitargo per accrescere le proprie masse muscolari, grazie ad un miglior recupero dalle sedute più impegnative e ad una migliore saturazione di glicogeno nelle fasi di ricarica di carboidrati. Unico neo del Vitargo, essendo coperto da brevetto, è il costo nettamente superiore rispetto agli altri integratori energetici.

[giuseppesole]

Ma credete davvero che si noterà la differenza, ai fini pratici dell' utente, tra maltodestrine DE19 (ottimo suggerimento di Elan) e vitargo? Io il Vitargo già ce l' ho in casa (quindi uso quello, che va benissimo), ma volendo consigliare l' utente, che come dice lui stesso ha anche un occhio di riguardo al portafogli, mi sento di consigliare assolutamente l' acquisto delle DE19.

Certo che non si noterà nessunissima differenza.

[Iruka]

beh la differenza c'è eccome, come scritto sopra...poi se non vogliamo nemmeno fidarci degli studi allora parliamo di aria fritta.

io mi sento di consigliare il meglio e non so quanto costi il torrent, non avendolo mai usato

[giuseppesole]

Cose note. Mi pare che, come sempre detto, l' indice glicemico (variabile peraltro a seconda della diluizione) sia alto e del tutto sovrapponibile alle DE19 proposte. La differenza fondamentale sta proprio nella minor tendenza a trattenere i liquidi, causando diarrea e comunque stati di disidratazione; caratteristiche queste, sensibili negli sport aerobici.
Ho infatti i miei dubbi riguardo all' ultimo trafiletto, nel quale si associa al Vitargo una capacità di reinfoltire più efficientemente le scorte di glicogeno anche dopo una seduta di bbing. Forse Bros ed Elan potranno dire la loro.

[Iruka]

vorrei far notare sempre la cosa fondamentale....viene assorbito prima delle maltodestrine!

[brosgym]

beh la differenza c'è eccome, come scritto sopra...poi se non vogliamo nemmeno fidarci degli studi allora parliamo di aria fritta.

io mi sento di consigliare il meglio e non so quanto costi il torrent, non avendolo mai usato

Non hai postato studi, solo un copiaincolla di un altro sito, se posti gli studi li leggiamo insieme

[Lenz]

Perche maltodestrine e specialmente destrosio implicano un picco di insulina inutile visto che il vitargo produce un picco molto minore ma ha una osmolarità maggiore quindi viene assorbito prima... Vi va bene?

basta studiare un po!

Il picco insulinico dipende anche dalle quantità, si parla proprio per questo di carico glicemico. Il Vitargo ha la caratteristica di essere assorbito velocemente, considera però che comporta una risposta insulinica analoga a destrosio e malto (peraltro sempre dipendente dalle quantità). La particolarità sembra essere che la glicemia viene tenuta medio alta anche dopo due ore dall'assunzione (http://scholarcommons.usf.edu/etd/3281/). Dipende però sempre e comunque dalle quantità. Secondo me, come dice Giuseppe, prenderlo postwo è abbastanza inutile, quantomeno sprecato. Destrosio e malto vanno benissimo, anche un mix dei due per permettere un assorbimento più rapido. Come ha scritto Unknown si dovrebbero sperimentare diversi quantitativi (io preferisco il rapporto 3:1 per le malto) e vedere con quale ci si trova meglio. Il Vitargo mi piace utilizzarlo nel during (ma io mi alleno a stomaco vuoto) per via del fatto che non appesantisce, non da acidità o fastidi vari, insomma va giù che è una meraviglia. Però in altre situazioni non lo vedo molto utile, meglio a questo punto, sempre come dice Giuseppe, in sport aerobici

[Iruka]

Sul sito della casa produttrice ci sono 3 studi che evidenziano l'utilità dell'utilizzo del vitargo, ma sono in pdf non posso linkare!, comunque ho un altro copia/incolla interessante, una intervista al co-fondatore della EAS che parla del vitargo:

The Truth Behind Vitargo


The post-workout or "anabolic/anti-catabolic"-window is without a doubt the most critical time frame for individuals wanting to transform their physique and, perhaps, for performance improvements.
The nutrients we consume during this time can have a tremendous affect on our physique and overall health. While there are many post workout products on the market, some are better than others. One of those is discussed here.

In the 1960's, a duo of Swedish university scientists began research on carbohydrate/glycogen loading and published their work in the worlds leading science journal. From this same laboratory, which also invented and pioneered creatine loading, a new product - now patented - was first proven, but until recently, it has essentially flown under the radar.
I wanted to learn as much as I could about this product, what the big deal is, and why it is any better than Gatorade, white bread, or other post-workout products.
To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada, B.Sc., M.Sc., one of the leading experts in the field of supplementation and nutrition.
Going into the interview I wasn't sure what to expect or how willing he would be to speak to me about this topic. However, coming out of the interview, nearly two hours later, I was nothing but impressed.
Mr. Almada's knowledge in the field was nothing short of astounding, and as I continued the interview, I noticed how humble and sincere he was. Let's learn a little more about this product, learn from one of the best in the field, and see how you can take your physique to the next level.


Who is Anthony Almada B.Sc, M.Sc?
Why was I surprised that Mr. Almada was so humble and sincere? Well, his CV is nothing short of impressive as he co-founded a company you might have heard of; EAS (formerly called Experimental and Applied Sciences).
That's right, he was essentially the mastermind behind that company and eventually sold the company to Bill Phillips. A graduate of Berkeley, with a Masters degree in nutrition and exercise biochemistry, Mr. Almada now finds himself running one of the hottest new companies in North America, GENr8, Inc. It has launched a new product in Vitargo® S2.

What's the big deal about post-workout recovery and this product? I wanted to learn as much as I could about this... To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada. Learn more.


The Truth Behind Vitargo

The post-workout or "anabolic/anti-catabolic"-window is without a doubt the most critical time frame for individuals wanting to transform their physique and, perhaps, for performance improvements.
The nutrients we consume during this time can have a tremendous affect on our physique and overall health. While there are many post workout products on the market, some are better than others. One of those is discussed here.
In the 1960's, a duo of Swedish university scientists began research on carbohydrate/glycogen loading and published their work in the worlds leading science journal. From this same laboratory, which also invented and pioneered creatine loading, a new product - now patented - was first proven, but until recently, it has essentially flown under the radar.
I wanted to learn as much as I could about this product, what the big deal is, and why it is any better than Gatorade, white bread, or other post-workout products.
To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada, B.Sc., M.Sc., one of the leading experts in the field of supplementation and nutrition.
Going into the interview I wasn't sure what to expect or how willing he would be to speak to me about this topic. However, coming out of the interview, nearly two hours later, I was nothing but impressed.
Mr. Almada's knowledge in the field was nothing short of astounding, and as I continued the interview, I noticed how humble and sincere he was. Let's learn a little more about this product, learn from one of the best in the field, and see how you can take your physique to the next level.


Who is Anthony Almada B.Sc, M.Sc?

• Why was I surprised that Mr. Almada was so humble and sincere? Well, his CV is nothing short of impressive as he co-founded a company you might have heard of; EAS (formerly called Experimental and Applied Sciences).

• That's right, he was essentially the mastermind behind that company and eventually sold the company to Bill Phillips. A graduate of Berkeley, with a Masters degree in nutrition and exercise biochemistry, Mr. Almada now finds himself running one of the hottest new companies in North America, GENr8, Inc. It has launched a new product in Vitargo® S2.

What is Vitargo®?

• This product is a patented molecular carbohydrate, currently derived from a special barley starch. This was where my confusion began as I asked Mr. Almada why I had heard it could come from waxy maize and even potato starch. "[The product] you must remember is its own entity, and has its own molecular hand print," Almada responded. "While it can come from waxy maize, potato starch or barley starch, or even wheat or rice starch, the extraction technique is what is necessary to create it. The starting starch is far less important.
  
  To say that waxy maize and other forms of starch are what make it is simply not true unless it is extracted into the specific, patented handprint that makes it. And since it is patented, knocking off [this product] carries the risk of a law suit," Almada adds.
  While it can be made from most plant starches (potato starch, barley starch, or waxy maize from corn), what makes it patented and the fastest way to replenishing glycogen is not the source, but the unique, patented molecular "handprint."
  "So it doesn't matter where it comes from, just that it is extracted properly and in our case here at [my company], we are using barley now and have the exclusive rights to [it] in several countries," Almada says.
  Is There Proof That It Works?
  • "Absolutely," Almada responds. "The first couple studies on [it] used potato starch and then eventually waxy maize, a type of starch that comes from a special strain of corn. This is where many companies got the idea to use waxy maize starches, but that is as far as they have gone. The magic of [this product] - the reason so many pro athletes/bodybuilders use it - is because it is PROVEN to work and DOES work," Almada says.
    "That is something few other companies can say, proof in human subjects that it is better than conventional post-workout drinks containing maltodextrin and sugars as the primary carbohydrate source. Again, this has been proven in university studies in athletes, not animals." Almada says.
  
  

So once we know for a fact that [this product] is present in our drink we must ask ourselves," Why is it different and more beneficial than Gatorade or white bread?" The key lies in its osmolality, molecular weight, and "branching".
Osmolality, molecular weight, and "branching" are key!
Osmolality simply refers to how much water is drawn around a specific object. Therefore, if Vitargo has a low osmolality, then very little water will be drawn into your stomach and you will have no residual bloating after consuming it. No bloating in the stomach simply means it moves through very quickly, exactly what we want it to do.
"If you feel bloated or have a full stomach you have failed to maximize the post-workout window. Recovery doesn't happen in your stomach - it happens in the muscle." Almada says.
"That is why [this product] is so beneficial, it gets through your stomach and into the blood stream twice as fast as conventional carbohydrates. The faster it gets through the stomach and into the blood, the quicker the muscle and liver glycogen can be replaced. If you are bloated or have a full stomach, the nutrients are in the stomach, not the bloodstream, and they can't help you if they aren't in the blood."
Ok, the low osmolality - which relates to the molecular size of the Vitargo molecule, aids in no bloating, but that can't be the only reason it gets into the blood faster than other carbohydrates? It's not, as the other reason lies in its high degree of branching. Low osmolality starches may be able to move through the stomach and into the small intestine - where they are digested and absorbed - but what good is a starch that is quick to leave the stomach but slow to be digested and absorbed?
This new product is proven in university studies to enter the region of the small intestine - the 'hot spot' for digestion and absorption - over twice as fast as an equal amount of carbohydrates from maltodextrin and sugars.
But the critical step is digesting the product - into glucose and maltose (two glucose molecules connected) - and then absorbing it.
The "branching" of the massive Vitargo molecule, like a red-wood tree, allows it to be digested and enter the blood at 2x faster rate. This is no test tube study - it is results in exercising humans. Since it passes through the stomach and into the small intestine, and enters the blood two times faster than conventional carbohydrates, it is that much more effective.


The Insulin Advantage:

• Ok - so now we have a way of delivering glucose into the blood with record speed (without the common side effect of bloating). In the recent university study mentioned above, the rate of rise of insulin, and the insulin "spike" was 1.8 times higher and faster in just TEN minutes after taking 100 grams of Vitargo, compared to an equal carbohydrate load from maltodextrin plus sugars following exhaustive exercise.
  What does insulin do? We all know it "opens" muscle cells to take in glucose, amino acids, and other muscle nutrients but what most do not know is that insulin is the body's major anti-catabolic hormone, which shuts off the increase in muscle proteolysis (protein breakdown) that follows intense resistance training.

The Mt. Everest insulin spike from this product explains why it can replenish muscle glycogen 1.7 times faster than these same carbohydrates: insulin activates the path of taking glucose into muscle and storing it as glycogen. Whether you lift weights, run track or are a long distance biker, the faster you absorb nutrients and replenish glycogen post workout, the faster you'll recover. If you can shut down muscle catabolism faster, you may also see and feel greater gains in physique and performance.
[.....]


Summary

• Vitargo can be synthesized from waxy maize, barley starch, or potatoes. The key is to have the specific, patented molecular hand print that is unique to it. While this can be done with any of the above sources. Waxy maize starch is NOT it - generic waxy maize starch is a SLOW DIGESTING starch. It is not this product unless properly extracted and therefore may be no more effective, or even inferior to, white bread.
• It passes through the stomach and intestines and into the bloodstream 2x faster than maltodextrin and sugar.
• It can replenish glycogen in muscles and liver following a workout 1.7x faster than maltodextrin and sugars.
• It will significantly enhance insulin release 1.8x higher and faster than maltodextrin and sugars following consumption, which will aid in glycogen replenishment.
• It passes through the stomach very quickly because of it low osmolality and high molecular weight. Therefore no bloating will occur. It enters the blood twice as fast because it is rapidly digested, due to the extensive branching of the Vitargo molecule.
• A new study has recently shown that combining this product and carnitine can greatly increase muscle carnitine and glycogen stores, while still burning body fat.

insomma un pò spiega citando degli studi il perchè è da preferire il vitargo..


negli studi postati sul loro sito i primi due sono interessanti

il primo:
Improved Gastric Emptying Rate in Humans of a Unique Glucose Polymer with Gel-forming Properties

Many athletes complain about sports drinks giving them stomach discomfort. All we can say about that is: It is history! Vitargo has a very low osmolality, giving you a rapid stomach emptying, in fact 80% faster than with ordinary sports drinks. The 2nd study made on Vitargo at Karolinska Institute of Sweden shows that. ’ Improved gastric emptying rate in humans of a unique glucose polymer with gel forming properties’ Scand. J. Gastroenterol 2000;35:1143-1149.

il secondo:

Muscle glycogen resynthesis rate in humans after supplementation of drinks containing carbohydrates with low and high molecular masses

Vitargo replenishes glycogen levels in your muscles 70% faster than any other sports drink carbohydrate! The 1st study made on Vitargo at Karolinska Institute of Sweden shows that. ’ Muscle glycogen resynthesis rate in humans after supplementation of drinks containing carbohydrates with low and high molecular masses’ Eur J Appl Physiol 81:346-351.

CON TANTO DI STUDI SCIENTIFICI ALLEGATI che potete vedervi.

[Lenz]

Purtroppo non è il mio lavoro cercare studi sugli integratori, sarei interessato ma non ho ne tempo ne voglia di cercare studi scientifici americani, ne tanto meno so da dove iniziare, comunque ho un altro copia/incolla interessante, una intervista al co-fondatore della EAS che parla del vitargo:

The Truth Behind Vitargo


The post-workout or "anabolic/anti-catabolic"-window is without a doubt the most critical time frame for individuals wanting to transform their physique and, perhaps, for performance improvements.
The nutrients we consume during this time can have a tremendous affect on our physique and overall health. While there are many post workout products on the market, some are better than others. One of those is discussed here.

In the 1960's, a duo of Swedish university scientists began research on carbohydrate/glycogen loading and published their work in the worlds leading science journal. From this same laboratory, which also invented and pioneered creatine loading, a new product - now patented - was first proven, but until recently, it has essentially flown under the radar.
I wanted to learn as much as I could about this product, what the big deal is, and why it is any better than Gatorade, white bread, or other post-workout products.
To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada, B.Sc., M.Sc., one of the leading experts in the field of supplementation and nutrition.
Going into the interview I wasn't sure what to expect or how willing he would be to speak to me about this topic. However, coming out of the interview, nearly two hours later, I was nothing but impressed.
Mr. Almada's knowledge in the field was nothing short of astounding, and as I continued the interview, I noticed how humble and sincere he was. Let's learn a little more about this product, learn from one of the best in the field, and see how you can take your physique to the next level.


Who is Anthony Almada B.Sc, M.Sc?
Why was I surprised that Mr. Almada was so humble and sincere? Well, his CV is nothing short of impressive as he co-founded a company you might have heard of; EAS (formerly called Experimental and Applied Sciences).
That's right, he was essentially the mastermind behind that company and eventually sold the company to Bill Phillips. A graduate of Berkeley, with a Masters degree in nutrition and exercise biochemistry, Mr. Almada now finds himself running one of the hottest new companies in North America, GENr8, Inc. It has launched a new product in Vitargo® S2.

What's the big deal about post-workout recovery and this product? I wanted to learn as much as I could about this... To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada. Learn more.


The Truth Behind Vitargo

The post-workout or "anabolic/anti-catabolic"-window is without a doubt the most critical time frame for individuals wanting to transform their physique and, perhaps, for performance improvements.
The nutrients we consume during this time can have a tremendous affect on our physique and overall health. While there are many post workout products on the market, some are better than others. One of those is discussed here.
In the 1960's, a duo of Swedish university scientists began research on carbohydrate/glycogen loading and published their work in the worlds leading science journal. From this same laboratory, which also invented and pioneered creatine loading, a new product - now patented - was first proven, but until recently, it has essentially flown under the radar.
I wanted to learn as much as I could about this product, what the big deal is, and why it is any better than Gatorade, white bread, or other post-workout products.
To find my answers, I had the privilege and honor to interview Anthony Almada, B.Sc., M.Sc., one of the leading experts in the field of supplementation and nutrition.
Going into the interview I wasn't sure what to expect or how willing he would be to speak to me about this topic. However, coming out of the interview, nearly two hours later, I was nothing but impressed.
Mr. Almada's knowledge in the field was nothing short of astounding, and as I continued the interview, I noticed how humble and sincere he was. Let's learn a little more about this product, learn from one of the best in the field, and see how you can take your physique to the next level.


Who is Anthony Almada B.Sc, M.Sc?

• Why was I surprised that Mr. Almada was so humble and sincere? Well, his CV is nothing short of impressive as he co-founded a company you might have heard of; EAS (formerly called Experimental and Applied Sciences).

• That's right, he was essentially the mastermind behind that company and eventually sold the company to Bill Phillips. A graduate of Berkeley, with a Masters degree in nutrition and exercise biochemistry, Mr. Almada now finds himself running one of the hottest new companies in North America, GENr8, Inc. It has launched a new product in Vitargo® S2.

What is Vitargo®?

• This product is a patented molecular carbohydrate, currently derived from a special barley starch. This was where my confusion began as I asked Mr. Almada why I had heard it could come from waxy maize and even potato starch. "[The product] you must remember is its own entity, and has its own molecular hand print," Almada responded. "While it can come from waxy maize, potato starch or barley starch, or even wheat or rice starch, the extraction technique is what is necessary to create it. The starting starch is far less important.
  
  To say that waxy maize and other forms of starch are what make it is simply not true unless it is extracted into the specific, patented handprint that makes it. And since it is patented, knocking off [this product] carries the risk of a law suit," Almada adds.
  While it can be made from most plant starches (potato starch, barley starch, or waxy maize from corn), what makes it patented and the fastest way to replenishing glycogen is not the source, but the unique, patented molecular "handprint."
  "So it doesn't matter where it comes from, just that it is extracted properly and in our case here at [my company], we are using barley now and have the exclusive rights to [it] in several countries," Almada says.
  Is There Proof That It Works?
  • "Absolutely," Almada responds. "The first couple studies on [it] used potato starch and then eventually waxy maize, a type of starch that comes from a special strain of corn. This is where many companies got the idea to use waxy maize starches, but that is as far as they have gone. The magic of [this product] - the reason so many pro athletes/bodybuilders use it - is because it is PROVEN to work and DOES work," Almada says.
    "That is something few other companies can say, proof in human subjects that it is better than conventional post-workout drinks containing maltodextrin and sugars as the primary carbohydrate source. Again, this has been proven in university studies in athletes, not animals." Almada says.

So once we know for a fact that [this product] is present in our drink we must ask ourselves," Why is it different and more beneficial than Gatorade or white bread?" The key lies in its osmolality, molecular weight, and "branching".
Osmolality, molecular weight, and "branching" are key!
Osmolality simply refers to how much water is drawn around a specific object. Therefore, if Vitargo has a low osmolality, then very little water will be drawn into your stomach and you will have no residual bloating after consuming it. No bloating in the stomach simply means it moves through very quickly, exactly what we want it to do.
"If you feel bloated or have a full stomach you have failed to maximize the post-workout window. Recovery doesn't happen in your stomach - it happens in the muscle." Almada says.
"That is why [this product] is so beneficial, it gets through your stomach and into the blood stream twice as fast as conventional carbohydrates. The faster it gets through the stomach and into the blood, the quicker the muscle and liver glycogen can be replaced. If you are bloated or have a full stomach, the nutrients are in the stomach, not the bloodstream, and they can't help you if they aren't in the blood."
Ok, the low osmolality - which relates to the molecular size of the Vitargo molecule, aids in no bloating, but that can't be the only reason it gets into the blood faster than other carbohydrates? It's not, as the other reason lies in its high degree of branching. Low osmolality starches may be able to move through the stomach and into the small intestine - where they are digested and absorbed - but what good is a starch that is quick to leave the stomach but slow to be digested and absorbed?
This new product is proven in university studies to enter the region of the small intestine - the 'hot spot' for digestion and absorption - over twice as fast as an equal amount of carbohydrates from maltodextrin and sugars.
But the critical step is digesting the product - into glucose and maltose (two glucose molecules connected) - and then absorbing it.
The "branching" of the massive Vitargo molecule, like a red-wood tree, allows it to be digested and enter the blood at 2x faster rate. This is no test tube study - it is results in exercising humans. Since it passes through the stomach and into the small intestine, and enters the blood two times faster than conventional carbohydrates, it is that much more effective.


The Insulin Advantage:

• Ok - so now we have a way of delivering glucose into the blood with record speed (without the common side effect of bloating). In the recent university study mentioned above, the rate of rise of insulin, and the insulin "spike" was 1.8 times higher and faster in just TEN minutes after taking 100 grams of Vitargo, compared to an equal carbohydrate load from maltodextrin plus sugars following exhaustive exercise.
  What does insulin do? We all know it "opens" muscle cells to take in glucose, amino acids, and other muscle nutrients but what most do not know is that insulin is the body's major anti-catabolic hormone, which shuts off the increase in muscle proteolysis (protein breakdown) that follows intense resistance training.

The Mt. Everest insulin spike from this product explains why it can replenish muscle glycogen 1.7 times faster than these same carbohydrates: insulin activates the path of taking glucose into muscle and storing it as glycogen. Whether you lift weights, run track or are a long distance biker, the faster you absorb nutrients and replenish glycogen post workout, the faster you'll recover. If you can shut down muscle catabolism faster, you may also see and feel greater gains in physique and performance.
[.....]


Summary

• Vitargo can be synthesized from waxy maize, barley starch, or potatoes. The key is to have the specific, patented molecular hand print that is unique to it. While this can be done with any of the above sources. Waxy maize starch is NOT it - generic waxy maize starch is a SLOW DIGESTING starch. It is not this product unless properly extracted and therefore may be no more effective, or even inferior to, white bread.
• It passes through the stomach and intestines and into the bloodstream 2x faster than maltodextrin and sugar.
• It can replenish glycogen in muscles and liver following a workout 1.7x faster than maltodextrin and sugars.
• It will significantly enhance insulin release 1.8x higher and faster than maltodextrin and sugars following consumption, which will aid in glycogen replenishment.
• It passes through the stomach very quickly because of it low osmolality and high molecular weight. Therefore no bloating will occur. It enters the blood twice as fast because it is rapidly digested, due to the extensive branching of the Vitargo molecule.
• A new study has recently shown that combining this product and carnitine can greatly increase muscle carnitine and glycogen stores, while still burning body fat.

insomma un pò spiega citando degli studi il perchè è da preferire il vitargo..

Ti ho risposto sopra non so se hai letto.. comunque tu hai scritto:
"Perche maltodestrine e specialmente destrosio implicano un picco di insulina inutile visto che il vitargo produce un picco molto minore"

Nello studio che TU hai postato invece dice:
In the recent university study mentioned above, the rate of rise of insulin, and the insulin "spike" was 1.8 times higher and faster in just TEN minutes after taking 100 grams of Vitargo, compared to an equal carbohydrate load from maltodextrin plus sugars following exhaustive exercise.

..

[Iruka]

Il picco insulinico dipende anche dalle quantità, si parla proprio per questo di carico glicemico. Il Vitargo ha la caratteristica di essere assorbito velocemente, considera però che comporta una risposta insulinica analoga a destrosio e malto (peraltro sempre dipendente dalle quantità). La particolarità sembra essere che la glicemia viene tenuta medio alta anche dopo due ore dall'assunzione (http://scholarcommons.usf.edu/etd/3281/). Dipende però sempre e comunque dalle quantità. Secondo me, come dice Giuseppe, prenderlo postwo è abbastanza inutile, quantomeno sprecato. Destrosio e malto vanno benissimo, anche un mix dei due per permettere un assorbimento più rapido. Come ha scritto Unknown si dovrebbero sperimentare diversi quantitativi (io preferisco il rapporto 3:1 per le malto) e vedere con quale ci si trova meglio. Il Vitargo mi piace utilizzarlo nel during (ma io mi alleno a stomaco vuoto) per via del fatto che non appesantisce, non da acidità o fastidi vari, insomma va giù che è una meraviglia. Però in altre situazioni non lo vedo molto utile, meglio a questo punto, sempre come dice Giuseppe, in sport aerobici

si ma parliamo anche di tempi di assimilazione maggiori, rispetto a un picco insulinico più basso!

---------- Post added at 17:41:16 ---------- Previous post was at 17:39:42 ----------

Ti ho risposto sopra non so se hai letto.. comunque tu hai scritto:
"Perche maltodestrine e specialmente destrosio implicano un picco di insulina inutile visto che il vitargo produce un picco molto minore"

Nello studio che TU hai postato invece dice:
In the recent university study mentioned above, the rate of rise of insulin, and the insulin "spike" was 1.8 times higher and faster in just TEN minutes after taking 100 grams of Vitargo, compared to an equal carbohydrate load from maltodextrin plus sugars following exhaustive exercise.

..

si ma ripeto entra anche in gioco l'osmolarità del polimero, è diverso rispetto al picco di una maltodestrina

---------- Post added at 17:48:39 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41:16 ----------

comunque ho trovato anche una conversazione interessante proprio nel forum riguardo questo: http://www.bodyweb.com/threads/30817...o-postwo/page3

evidentemente non sono l'unico a pensare questo!

---------- Post added at 17:51:44 ---------- Previous post was at 17:48:39 ----------

La particolarità sembra essere che la glicemia viene tenuta medio alta anche dopo due ore dall'assunzione (http://scholarcommons.usf.edu/etd/3281/).

e ti pare poco? secondo me è meglio tenere un livello abbastanza stabile che un picco altissimo e poi una discesa altrettanto veloce!

[homerobert]

Scusate ragazzi non volevo scatenare una bagarre......
in ogni caso adesso vi volevo ringraziare per le risposte edopo tutto questo leggere avrei deciso di preparare il mio post wo con :
Maltodestrine e destrosio in rapporto 1:3
Creapure degussa
Bcaa
poi dopo 20 minuti le whey


Successivamente proverò il vitargo.
non essendo un bb a livelli esagerati.

[Lenz]

si ma parliamo anche di tempi di assimilazione maggiori, rispetto a un picco insulinico più basso!

---------- Post added at 17:41:16 ---------- Previous post was at 17:39:42 ----------



si ma ripeto entra anche in gioco l'osmolarità del polimero, è diverso rispetto al picco di una maltodestrina che c'entra? Sto dicendo che hai scritto una cosa e poi pubblicato uno studio che sosteneva esattamente il contrario..

---------- Post added at 17:48:39 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41:16 ----------

comunque ho trovato anche una conversazione interessante proprio nel forum riguardo questo: http://www.bodyweb.com/threads/30817...o-postwo/page3

evidentemente non sono l'unico a pensare questo!

---------- Post added at 17:51:44 ---------- Previous post was at 17:48:39 ----------



e ti pare poco? secondo me è meglio tenere un livello abbastanza stabile che un picco altissimo e poi una discesa altrettanto veloce! L'ideale è fare un pasto completo a distanza di un'oretta o meno dal postwo, senza scomodare fondi per il vitargo, l'utente ha detto per l'appunto che voleva risparmiare. Come ho scritto il Vitargo non è inferiore, ha i suoi vantaggi ma è veramente sprecato, la differenza è impercepibile a livello pratico.

Non te la prendere, non parlo da chissà quale pulpito anche perchè non me lo posso permettere, però mi sembra che tu abbia preso un posizione di principio e stia utilizzando motivazioni, tra l'altro discordi tra loro, per sostenere la tesi. Concordo sul fatto che il Vitargo sia migliore, ma la differenza è veramente poca, soprattutto a questi livelli!